The Future is Abundant – A Conversation With Larry Santoyo
Sustainable World Radio

Permaculture and Ecological Designer Larry Santoyo talks with Jill Cloutier about how the future is abundant, why he’s not into mainstreaming permaculture, permaculture crimes, how security is between your ears, and why we should seek to be valuable, not rich.

The point Larry makes about the future being abundant is such a powerful one, in the midst of all the fear mongering we experience today. He talks about how big of a role permaculture has in that abundance, and how he wants it to be a more intrinsic display in our entire lives, rather than trying to “mainstream” it. He expresses how the evolution/popularity of permaculture is moving along at a perfectly fine rate, and how often when people try to force things into “mainstreaming”, they get perverted and skewed.

He also explains a really great concept of using permaculture, and not doing it. You use permaculture in what you do. This opens up the opportunity for anyone, not just gardeners to use it. Doctors, teachers, lawyers, anyone.

He shares his typical soundbite/definition as: Permaculture is decision-making protocols for critical thinking and problem-solving.

You can listen to the whole podcast here:



Larry Santoyo is a green business consultant and senior planner at EarthFlow Design Works. He has taught environmental design at colleges and universities nationwide. Larry is also on the faculty at the Menlo Lab in Los Angeles. You can find Larry online here and at City of Angels Permaculture.


To listen to tons of other sustainability and permaculture podcasts with Jill, Visit Sustainable World Radio.